(07/11/24) Area “8” Meeting Report
July 11th Meeting Report
Indian Hills Urban Service District
As always, my personal thoughts, insights, or notes are stated as such and in no way reflect anyone else's thoughts or opinions other than my own.
If you also attended, please feel free to add, correct, etc.
(sorry for any typos)
The area this meeting was set for was titled "Area 8" for IHCC mapping purposes, but anyone was welcome to attend.
I counted ~150 homes in this mapped area. All homes across JFK.
There were 6 IHCC board members attending.
I counted ~18 others in attendance.
(not including 3 of us who have attended multiple meetings)
Also in attendance:
NO City Council members
1 Police Officer (NOT the same officer as the last meeting)
There is one final IHCC Meeting scheduled – July 25th.
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The President of IHCC opened the meeting with the usual information BUT added statements such as: “Don’t interrupt or be disruptive, don’t shout, please wait your turn, let everyone speak, etc.”
Information I had not heard before (but may have just missed)
The community property is worth over $800,000
The lakes provide storm draining/water retention from the NLR Airport down to 5 Mile Creek
UPDATE TO DAMS
Whit E. Montague (Engineer Supervisor, Dam Safety, Arkansas Division of Natural Resources) who did the unofficial “inspection” of the dams on Nov. 3, 2023 will return with City Representatives on Monday, July 15th to take another look at the dams and the progress made.
**Personal note
After many conversations with the Army Corps of Engineers -- Everything they have indicates there has never been any forcible breaches of dams.
Hopefully, this eases some concerns.
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QUESTIONS, STATEMENTS, & COMMENTS
(there were A LOT!)
Question- Was there a way to keep the pool?
Answer - The pool would need almost a 1 million $$ for renovations to get it up to code. The original USD proposal of $20 would have gone towards this but would have required a bond. Having a bond meant the USD would have been for 16 years (length of the loan). Neighborhood response was mixed and it was pointed out the pool is only open 3 months of the year so “return on investment” was low for many neighbors.Question - Are the lakes being operated as originally designed / serving as storm water retention? (note – the gentleman asking this question was extremely knowledgeable about the lakes and dams!)
Answer – Yes, although the dams have been slightly modified over the last 60 years which has harmed the water retention. Sediment build up is also harming the water retention.Question - How much money was earned from operating the pool?
Answer – in 2021 the pool earned ~$6000 in profit. Estimated income was ~$81,000 but cost to operate was ~$75,000. Pool already had leaks and other issues at this point, which drove up operating costs. (these numbers were “off the top of the head” so may not be exact. Would have to look back at the financials)Question - When the Original POA was put into place, was there greenspace around the lakes for walking?
Answer – No. Public easements around the lakes was never part of the plan.Question - Is there currently access to the upper dam?
Answer – No, but this is hopefully going to change. Home on the corner of Comanche/Pontiac (where the dam access used to be until it was fenced off) has new owners. IHCC is talking with new owners about returning the old 25’ easement to the club so the upper dam can be accessed again.Question - If the USD passes, once all the renovations are done will the areas be 100% handicap accessible?
Answer – Yes, all construction will be ADA compliant (this does not apply to dam access or the walking trails, as no construction will be done)Questions - Can the USD allow for an opt-out/opt-in? Can the USD do “tiered” payment options (some pay more than others?) because some get more benefit than others (aka: lake property owners).
Answer – No, the USD law doesn’t allow for a “pick and choose” option. It’s an all or nothing. A “district” has to be a defined area.Question – Do you really feel it’s realistic to say the fee will be reduced after the first 10 years?
Answer – Yes, but I am not an economist. The current proposal contains a lot of high cost expenses (demo of pool, build pavilion, dredge lake) that won’t be included in the next USD proposal. Maintenance costs less than building.
**side note – the Heritage Park USD was originally $20.64 per month for residents. It just renewed for another 10 years. New cost? $25.00 per month.Question - Since the lakes serve an important purpose for a large part of the city (not just Indian Hills) why can’t the City help?
Answer – The City can’t “give” money to private property (which is what the IH property currently is). It can only provide “transactional” assistance. Which is why they were recently able to provide the $24,000 to help with the dams. Because the dams DO serve a large portion of the city.Question - How will park security issues be addressed?
Answer – Best way to keep the property safe and secure is to have it in use so there are “eyes on” the property. Budget also includes a security gate that will open and close automatically.Question – If the USD doesn’t pass, will the property automatically go to the City?
Answer – There is no certainty of what will happen to the property. The City would have to agree to take it. Alternatively, it could be sold to a private entity. It would be difficult to develop though*. *(note – this was said by the moderator, not me)Question – Can the original plat for the property be found?
Answer – It has proved difficult to find anything “original” due to age and difficulty tracking down anyone from Winrock (developer) or the engineers.Statement – 2005 the lakes were dredged by the City due to the NLR Airport runway being extended and the sediment runoff flowing into the lakes
Question - Will 25% of the USD budget be enough for the lakes/dam work needed?
Answer – Hopefully. There are several methods of dredging. Current quote IHCC received was for $200,000 to remove a certain amount of material. But amount of material needed to remove is unknown. To find out, would cost even more. Amount should be sufficient for repairs to concrete cap/ shoreline rocks (rip/rap), etc.Question – Has IHCC spoken with those who oppose the USD and tried to find a compromise?
Answer (personal note – the answer is NO but the moderator didn’t flat out say this, instead they listed the reasons of concern brought up by the oppose group and why they wouldn’t work so I will list them below)
#1 - The USD isn’t a “democratic process” because it only requires 25% of the neighborhood to support it.
IHCC was asked to commit to getting 50% (or more) support (personal note – when the oppose group suggested this, they also offered to help provide manpower to canvas) but IHCC doesn’t think it’s possible to talk to that many people. People don’t answer the doors, don’t respond to letters or flyer, etc.
(personal note – the irony of IHCC admitting they think getting 50% is impossible, knowing full well the law they chose to utilize requires anyone who opposes the USD to get 50% is the height of hypocrisy.)
#2 – Some in the neighborhood can’t afford $8.50 per month.
IHCC admits this may be a burden for some living in Indian Hills (we have a lot of elderly folks on fixed income) so they have found volunteers who are willing to pay more to cover the cost of those who can’t pay.
(personal note – while I applaud the generosity of others this plan has multiple problems.
First – As IHCC admits, the USD isn’t “pick and choose” so it if passes, EVERYONE will be charged the $8.50 per month on their water bill. This means having to identify those who can’t afford to pay in the first place. Not everyone wants to be so transparent with their financial situation for the world to see.
Second– that means donors would have to give the money directly TO the residents to offset the money paid via their water bill.
Third – donors means volunteers. Volunteers means organization. People would have to ensure the donors were paying the residents who can’t afford the USD. One of the reasons IHCC is in this position to begin with is lack of volunteers/interest/donations, etc…. How would this be any different?
Fourth - What happens if the donor moves? Will the person who buys their house agree to continue paying someone else’s USD fees?)
#3 – Why not start with the lake property owner USD first, instead of the entire neighborhood?
IHCC doesn’t believe this is a feasible prospect. They cannot raise enough money from the 52 homes around the lake.
(personal note – The oppose side suggested lake AND park property owners to start with. Once it was established, they could then sell memberships to anyone in the neighborhood who was interested. Also, establishing the smaller USD would provide a source of income they state is needed for grants (aka: matching funds) as well as show the City there was a stable source of income)Question – What about the homes on the other side of JFK? What benefit do they get from all of this?
Answer – IHCC is anticipating less interest from the homes on the other side of JFK. But they do have people in that area that have been adamant about supporting the USD.
At this point, one of the board members attempted to state the folks living across JFK benefit from the lakes storm water retention and they would see their streets flood should those lakes fail.
The moderator (and pretty much everyone else in the room) quickly corrected them. The homes on the other side of JFK are in a completely different drainage basin.
(I’m including pics of Indian Hills and the drainage basins. Yellow denotes the drainage area associated with the Indian Hills lakes. Blue is all of Indian Hills.)
Note – the folks who live on the other side of North Hills are also in a different drainage basin.Question - How many board members live on the lakes? (there are currently 9 board members)
Answer – 4 live on the lakes, 1 lives next to the park. There are 9 board members total.Question– Has IHCC considered having the lake property declared a drainage district instead of it being a homeowner issue?
Answer – unsure if that is feasible
